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| From | Message | Posted by andy94
chessbase.net
11/16/2008
08:02:21
Play online chess |  Subject: A chess saying...
Message:
"White plays to win, black plays to draw."
I don't remember who said it, but it's an interesting thing to talk about.
What do you think?
| Posted by ionadowman
chessbase.net
11/16/2008
12:36:32
Play online chess | Is it indeed attributable to one person?...
Message:
I seems to have been the approach taken by many chess masters, but certainly not all. Judging by the recent World Championship match, Vishy Anand had no idea of taking such a line. Bobby Fischer would have thought such an approach pusillanimous.
I much prefer the attitude of one Efim Bogoljubov, who flourished in the '20s and '30s: "When I have White, I win because I have the White pieces; when I have Black, I win because I am Bogojubov."
Cheers,
Ion
| Posted by ccmcacollister
chessbase.net
11/16/2008
14:02:17
Play online chess | I have always liked Bogo's~! Very masterful :))
Message:
Corollaries:
Alekhine: "When I am WT I win because I am Alekhine, with black I win because you Are Bogojubov".
Mine: "When I am White I win because You are not Bogojubov, with black I win because Bogojubov is deceased and only had an hour to get to the board. "
{ "Wait a minute, I won? What happened??" }
}8-)
About drawing with black, winning with WT. Obviously it Wins any single match. Besides that it is often used in RR or double RR play particularly amongst near equals and in long events. In Swiss play, especially short ones, it is not so commonly sought.
There it might be more like: Crush the lower rated because you are higher rated; Win with WT among your peers; and Let's see about winning with black among peers and betters since I hope to know my chosen defense better, but if not perhaps I will grace them (aka "bail out" :) with a draw . . .
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Nakamura crushing competition — St. Louis' own Hikaru Nakamura is crushing the competition at the Super-Grandmaster chess tournament being held in Reggio Emilia, Italy. Hikaru has been playing often of late and has more than made up for his bad performance in Moscow at the Tal Memorial (last place) with back-to-back fantastic results! Last month, Hikaru was able to clinch clear second at the London Chess Classic, ahead of world No. 1 Magnus Carlsen. Hikaru is doing even better in Reggio after starting out with a scintillating score of five points out of six games against the world's best. After a draw against Fabiano Caruano of Italy in round seven, Hikaru had a slight misstep in round eight as he lost to Alexander Morozovich, the chess player just ...
Posted by kansaspatzer
chessbase.net
11/16/2008
14:04:45
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Message:
I think that such an approach is more applicable at a higher level than most of us are at. Certainly, when you look at the world championship matches such as the one just played between Kramnik and Anand, the notion of who was White and who was Black was critical to match strategy (and it was a very big deal when Anand won as Black.) At my level - I'm around 1600 both on here and OTB, I'm going to play for a win any time I'm playing somebody unless they're much higher rated than I am, in which case I may head for drawish lines, knowing that heading for a technical endgame will likely play into the hands of someone with more endgame experience than myself.
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Kaidanov's chess homework pays at Eastern Open — Kentucky GM Gregory Kaidanov is perhaps better known today as a chess teacher than a competitor. But he gave his students an object lesson on the value of doing one’s homework while winning the 39th annual Eastern Open, held last week at its traditional home at the Westin Washington hotel downtown. With 2½ points in the chess tournament’s final three rounds, including victories over fellow GMs Alexander Ivanov and Magesh Panchanathan, the affable Kaidanov posted an undefeated 6-1 result, a half-point ahead of Ivanov and New Jersey IM Dean Ippolito. A total of 170 chess players competed in the event’s four sections. Kaidanov revealed after his critical Round 5 win over Ivanov that he had worked out fully ...
Posted by cascadejames
chessbase.net
11/16/2008
20:39:57
Play online chess | Better with Black?
Message:
For reasons that are unclear to me, I have consistently had a better record on Gameknot with
black. So I am skeptical about the application of the rule to those of use who are not Class A
players or higher.
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Chess: Turning the tide — After a strong start world chess champion Vishy Anand falls to an enterprising counterattack. The world chess champion Vishy Anand only made a 50% score at the recent London Chess Classic, suffering this early defeat to the US no 1. Anand started well, but with so many pieces on the chess board and both kings compromised, a counterattack is always possible. How did Nakamura turn the game in his favour? RB: Wow, complicated. I really have no idea. Maybe – this is clutching at straws – I can march my second h-pawn down the board to try to open up the White king position? It looks promising, but then runs into the problem of White's light-square bishop, which has an eye on h3. 1…Qe8 doesn't help, because ...
Posted by lighttotheright
chessbase.net
11/16/2008
21:35:48
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I sometimes play for a draw, even when I'm white. I drew a 2300 + player recently doing just that. I was surprised to get an early lead, but I knew it wasn't enough to win. When I got a chance to trade Queens, I took it. I had to give back some material to force a draw, but it worked.
I sometimes lose a game because I push things too far - trying to force a win.
———
On Chess: Is struggling Anand looking ahead? — Recent months haven’t been kind to reigning world chess champion Viswanathan Anand, who posted mediocre results in three consecutive chess tournaments. His last effort — the London Chess Classic, in which he scored six draws, one loss and just one win — was, in his words and by his standards, “a disaster” not befitting the status of world chess champion. No doubt he was distracted, in part, by preparations for an upcoming May title defense against Boris Gelfand in Moscow’s renowned Tretyakov art gallery — a venue that Anand hopes will inspire “ beautiful and artistic chess.” Based on their past performances in hundreds of games, Anand is an almost a 3-to-2 favorite to win the 12-game match. He also has ...
Posted by kansaspatzer
chessbase.net
11/16/2008
22:34:56
Play online chess |
Message:
An attitude I would generally find more profitable would be "keeping the draw in hand" rather than "outright playing for the draw". Trying to push for a miniscule advantage is easier than pushing outright for a draw, in which you aren't able to claim any positional advantages, which can be tricky since playing for a draw tends to be harder than it sounds.
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Chess: The Year in Review — Chess again crossed paths with politics in 2011, with the most remarkable moment occurring in Tripoli, Libya, during the NATO bombing campaign against Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi. Kirsan Ilyumzhinov, the World Chess Federation president, flew to Libya in June and played Qaddafi. Ilyumzhinov had known the Libyan leader since at least 2004, and there was speculation that he was on a mission to try to end the war. The game ended in a draw, but the war continued. (Tripoli fell to the rebels two months later, and Qaddafi was killed in October.) Politics also shadowed an achievement by Ehsan Ghaem Maghami, an Iranian chess grandmaster who set a record in February by playing 614 people at ...
Posted by blake78613
chessbase.net
11/17/2008
04:55:41
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Message:
When I am Black, I am happy to repeat a line that lead to a draw, and will keep repeating it until someone finds a way to obtain an advantage. While with White if I draw with a line, I will start looking for a different line.
| Posted by ionadowman
chessbase.net
11/17/2008
12:29:51
Play online chess | Back in '83 ...
Message:
... I got roped into a six-round Easter tournament, having played just one game (in a telegraph match) in the previous 12 months. Naturally I wasn't in form, having made no preparation. In the event Black won all six of my games!
On reflection, I suppose that wasn't such a good occasion to depart from my usual English Opening to try opening lines I hadn't played before. That wasn't very clever... :(
Cheers,
Ion
| Posted by farhadexists
chessbase.net
11/18/2008
08:07:12
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Message:
At my level (1500-1600), I don't think it matters, as almost every single game is decided by a blunder of some sort, mine or my opponent's.
Then again, I've won 60% of my games as White here on GK, and 53% as Black, so maybe I have no idea what I'm talking about.
Farhad
| Posted by wulebgr
chessbase.net
11/19/2008
06:16:37
Play online chess | another
Message:
Black is Okay
The title of a series of books, and allegedly a famous statement by some player--I don't know who.
| Posted by ketchuplover
chessbase.net
11/19/2008
06:24:03
Play online chess |
Message:
Chess is a theoretical draw-Bobby Fischer
| Posted by andy94
chessbase.net
11/19/2008
07:28:51
Play online chess |
Message:
Thanks ketchuplover, lack that quote of Bobby!
| Posted by fmgaijin
chessbase.net
11/19/2008
10:50:48
Play online chess | Andras Adorjan, wulebgr
Message:
EOM
| Posted by markb56
chessbase.net
12/04/2008
11:14:19
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Message:
I have a terrible time playing as White both on GK and OTB. My win record as Black is about 20% higher both on GK and OTB. I prefer playing with a plan (e.g positional) rather than attack. It also depends on the opponent -- young players seem to have a harder time grinding it out than older players, as they need constant stimulus to stay interested.
| Posted by ionadowman
chessbase.net
12/04/2008
11:50:06
Play online chess | I guess it depends...
Message:
... on what you find "stimulating" enough to keep your interest. Consider that you are down a pawn in a rook ending; possibly - even probably - a draw, but your opponent has whatever the winning chances going. What keeps you interested enough to play the thing down to its last gasp - lose or draw? It could, of course, be your place in a tournament - the possibility of a "grade prize" (if such things are offered), or, since your opponent has 200 ELO rating points more, there's the "moral victory" of acquiring a significant boost to your own rating and an addition to your chess CV.
Then, there's the intellectual exercise of making the best of the situation, finding whatever tactics there might be in the position, of setting your opponent problems. The same goes if you're on the upside of such an endgame.
Maybe it's worth thinking of it in these terms: When down, you are extracting a draw from a game probably lost; when ahead, you are extracting a win from a game probably drawn! Grinding out the win is not always - I find it's not even usually - lacking in interest.
Cheers,
Ion
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